Making the leap, need input

WolfGT

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#1
OK, I think I'm going to try to make the leap in preparation for Windrock. Here are the issues at hand that are making me want to go this route.

  1. I have a vibration in the front that gets worse everytime I go to the trails. I am pretty sure it is a bent/dented front driveshaft.
  2. My tires are about gone. The tread life is coming to an end.
  3. I have been beating the living crap out of my rims and they are beginning to give out.
  4. My tcase drop is killing me without a lift.

So here is what I want to do. I already have bumpers and a skid plate on the way. I would like to put beadlocks and 35's on it. So here are the questions:

  1. Can my current axles handle the tire size? (stock 2002 TJ axles) I know this depends on my right foot but just in general. I am planning on putting in new axles but will they hold up for a trip or two?
  2. What kind of lift am I going to need to accomidate going from my 31's to 35's?
  3. Would it be smart to do a budget lift and body lift or is it a waste of money?
  4. Are the bolt patterns different from my current setup to my future setup (let's say an 8.8)? This question is to figure out whether buying the beadlocks now is even smart because of a pending bolt pattern change.
  5. With whatever lift is recommended, will I need to change/lengthen my driveshafts? (since I have to replace one anyway ...)

Your assistance in helping me figure out what to is greatly appreciated and I will need to get on it right away. I'm looking forward to your replies.
 

WolfGT

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#2
Why when looking at suspension lift kits the recommended tire sizes are so small. Just an example: A Rough Country 4" short arm kit recommends 33" tires. Things like this just confuse me because I know it just doesn't add up. I believe Brooks is running a 3 or 4 inch lift and he has 35's. Confusing.
 

LBarr2002

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#3
The lift companies rate lifts for the biggest tire that will fit with no trimming and no rubbing at all. I guess its a liability thing, they don't want to be responsible for you screwing something else up. Your best bet is to look for a thread describing what tires will fit with what lifts and how much trimming. I don't know enough about TJ's to help you there. Not sure about driveshaft lengths either.

You could run 35's on your stock axles without lockers if your easy on it, but still not recommended. Do you know what the stock gearing is? You won't be cruising down the highway too well with 3.07's and 35s. You'd also have more fun with 31" tires beating on it than 35's being easy I think.

I would not do a body lift because you'll only want to take it off later.

An Explorer 8.8 would be the same bolt pattern, but I don't know if your front axle replacement would be the same.
 
#4
With just a few inches of lift and a jump up to a 31" you'll notice a tremendous difference. The Jeep will be able to go more places just by having it's a$$ up off the ground more.
 
#5
Go with a 3" lift and hiline your jeep, fitting 35s won't be an issue with this combo. I would recommend going with new springs all the way around and save to body lift and/or spacers for fine tuning down the road if you need it. You'll need and new cv rear driveshaft, SYE and at least adjustable rear UCAs. Also remember event bump stops front and rear to limit your up travel. Your front driveshaft will be fine and adjustable front UCAs would be a nice addition but you can get away without them on 3"s. You can get Fred at fleet pride to check your front drivers aft to see if it needs to be rebalanced or if the cv needs a rebuild.

You could get away with using the d35 for cruising around town, I just wouldn't wheel with it on 35s. I ran around town with the d35 still in my TJ after I did the 5.2 swap and was sitting on 32s for a few months. I knew it was a ticking time bomb but just took it easy until I started hanging the tons (but I did do a few front burn outs and the d30 took every bit of it).

If you are still planning on the axle swap I would check out pirate4x4 every few days as there have been a bunch of guys swapping out axles from their TJs to include d44/9 inch combos, waggys, etc that would be bolt ins. Also ECGS is now selling a custom bolt in d60 rear that can be set up any way that you want it.
 
#6
ask ben and sam on this forum how the d35 holds up to 35s.... lots of broken parts later and now they both have 8.8s...

Greg, do you have 3.07s or 3.73s? I cant remember
 

WolfGT

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#7
how are your rims "giving out"? u dont need a tcase drop if its at stock height i would avoid it even with a lift.. my jeep has roughly 3 inches of lift on 37s. your driveshafts will be fine with a lift
The edges of the rims are getting rolled on the rocks. I have been noticing warpage and was wondering how long it would be before the beads started to give. Now one of them is not sealing right so I figure I'm going to have nothing but trouble from here on out.

The tcase drop was on my jeep when I got it with not lift and 31's.
 

WolfGT

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#9
With just a few inches of lift and a jump up to a 31" you'll notice a tremendous difference. The Jeep will be able to go more places just by having it's a$$ up off the ground more.
I already run 31s. The question is what all do I have to do to my current setup to go to 35s and be somewhat reliable. I can't go all out right now witch complete axle replacements. I just don't think I have the time to do it and feel safe for a trip to TN. Unless I get some help.
 
#10
a 2" budget boost and 1" body lift would get you on 35s but your gearing will not support them. You need at least 4.10s to run 35s effectively. With 3.07s you are stuck with 31s-32s max if you want to be able to control your jeep at slow speeds offroad.
 
#12
if you want to run 35s you need at a minimum:

lower geared axles (at least 4.10)

beefed tie rod

2" bb and 1" body lift
I agree with that. I run tube fenders too which helps me maintain a lower lift and bigger tires. I have the 8.8 for you that has 3.73s i can set up if you want it.
 
#13
I upgraded from 32's to 35's and did a few things a bit backwards by trying to be cheap about it. I already had a 4" lift which is a bit saggy. For 35's you want at least 5" of lift. My upgrades consisted of the following, in order:

8.8 LS from pullapart with 4.10 gearing ($100)
associated hardware for 8.8 install ($250)
some cheap/used 35's already mounted to assess roadability rubbing issues ($75)
D30 with 4.11 gearing ($150)
1" body lift ($100)
Trimmed rear fender well added TJ flares ($50)
KM2's mounted ($1100)
SYE and driveshaft ($400)

I threw in cost estimates to give you an idea. Clearance with this setup is ok, but I could use another 1/2 to 1" OF lift. If I could have done it all over again, I would have done the SYE at same time as 8.8. So counting brand new tires and wheels, it ran me right around $2000.

You need new tires so that puts you in a bit of a tough spot meaning that you can't upgrade slowly over time with the ultimate goal of running 35's. If 35's are what you know you want, I suggest ponying up the money and building your rig out correctly with lift, SYE and driveshaft, and rear axle.

EDIT: I see Brooks commented a 2" BB and 1" BL will accommodate 35's. Disregard my comment about 5" lift being needed - my experience is with YJs and my springs might be saggier than I realized.
 
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WolfGT

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#14
If I put a 3" lift on it, will I need to do anything to the drive shafts? ...SYE? ...Longer shafts? or is 3" within the realm of acceptability with stock shafts?
 
#15
You can get by with a SYE but its a good idea to get an SYE and new shaft as soon as you can just to take care of vibrations. Carolina driveline in spartanburg has a combo deal for a 231 (the tcase in your jeep) slip yoke eliminator and new driveshaft, they just require you to measure the distance between pinion and the yoke on the transfer case after its lifted. You'll also want rear adjustable upper arms to adjust the pinion angle of the rear axle.
 

WolfGT

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#16
One remaining issue. If I go and put everything on, new axles, lift, tires and wheels. I will have to then order the rear driveshaft. Can I drive it with just the front to get it home in the mean time? It's a 2 hour drive.
 
#17
Yeah you can drive on the front ds. i did it when my rear was being worked on when i lived in Atlanta. Can't drive fast and you can't take off fast. Other then that it was ok.
My wife had a Full Traction 3" basic kit ($575) w/FT shocks. We ran 285x75x16 bighorns on it. It had a stock gears (3:79 i think) and it pulled them around really good. We did a hack n tap and had to put rear upper control arms on it to adjust pinion angle. That jeep was amazing. i ll find some pictures of tellico when she had it. (rockhard sliders and bumper too)
lift: http://www.quadratec.com/products/16064_302X_PG.htm
tires: http://www.quadratec.com/products/92612_1XX_PG.htm

With 33s you have to pick the lines.. with 35s you can get sloppy.. with 37s you get stupid.
stick with 33s.. save some money for some axles, wheel it with the d35,
 
#18
Yeah you can drive on the front ds. i did it when my rear was being worked on when i lived in Atlanta. Can't drive fast and you can't take off fast. Other then that it was ok.
My wife had a Full Traction 3" basic kit ($575) w/FT shocks. We ran 285x75x16 bighorns on it. It had a stock gears (3:79 i think) and it pulled them around really good. We did a hack n tap and had to put rear upper control arms on it to adjust pinion angle. That jeep was amazing. i ll find some pictures of tellico when she had it. (rockhard sliders and bumper too)
lift: http://www.quadratec.com/products/16064_302X_PG.htm
tires: http://www.quadratec.com/products/92612_1XX_PG.htm

With 33s you have to pick the lines.. with 35s you can get sloppy.. with 37s you get stupid.
stick with 33s.. save some money for some axles, wheel it with the d35,
wheeling with the 35 wouldnt be a problem if he wanted to keep the 31s for a while, but he wants to go to 33s or 35s and the 3.07s arent going to cut it with 35s... And there is no sense in gearing the d35.
 

WolfGT

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#19
Will I be able to get it going 60-65 down the interstate to get it home on just the front axle with 35's and 4.88 gears? (without putting the tach over the top?)
 
#20
yes you will be fine the tach wont be going any higher than it would if you were driving in rear wheel drive. with 35s and 4.88s i'm at 2500 at ~75 from what I recall.
 
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